Forging a Freelance Journey, Digital Nomadism, and Creative Community with Graphic Design - Jane Kisnica is RightOffTrack

Anya Smith:
Hello everyone, welcome to the Write Off Track podcast where we venture into the extraordinary stories that remind us it's okay to stray off the beaten path. I'm thrilled to present our next guest, Jane Kisnica, who exemplifies the spirit in every facet of her journey. Jane is a true creative, driving a thriving, freelancing graphic design career fueled by over five years of experience in the design and marketing fields. Her journey through design and marketing industries has equipped her with a depth of experience that she's channeled to help small businesses and solopreneurs bring their ideas to life. Beyond her design prowess, Jane embodies the digital nomad lifestyle, traveling the globe while also inspiring as a content creator on LinkedIn. Her platform has become a vibrant space for insightful discussions where she candidly shares her experiences as a freelancer, delving into the highs and lows of her journey and fearlessly addressing mental health issues. But Jane is more than a designer. She's a creative ally and a genius source of inspiration. Her witty sense of humor, combined of her authentic approach to sharing knowledge, has cultivated a devoted and loyal audience. In this episode, we'll delve into Jane's unique journey, exploring her design expertise, her adventures as a digital nomad, and her advocacy for mental health awareness. Get ready to be inspired as Jane's genuine narrative and ingenious design services take center stage. Join us as we uncover her extraordinary story that reminds us it's okay to stray off the beaten path. Welcome, Jean.

Jane Kisnica:
Thank you. That was, that was one hell of an intro. Thank you. Good to be here.

Anya Smith:
I mean, you are an amazing human being. And before we start, I just want to say a little shout out to Earl Talbot, who introduced us. I feel like he's blessed my life of so many wonderful things. And one of those is introduction of you. And so I knew that when I reach out, like, okay, if he likes Jane, she's going to be an amazing human being. And then

Jane Kisnica:
I'm gonna

Anya Smith:
we connected

Jane Kisnica:
go.

Anya Smith:
and I was like, okay, she's traveling the world. She's doing all the things. She has an amazing audience. And then. through our conversation, you were just so authentic and easy to talk to, and I was like so impressed by that balance of everything you're doing. So thank you for joining us.

Jane Kisnica:
It's my pleasure to be here. I'm excited for this chat.

Anya Smith:
My pleasure is all mine too. And for our audience, I'm sure a lot of the audience listening is going to already know you and love you and be part of your audience. But for those that may not, can you share a little bit about the story to where now you have this big following, you're doing all this amazing stuff in digital design, but that wasn't always the case. How did you maybe get to where you are today and what were some of the main milestones up to this way?

Jane Kisnica:
Um, right. Yeah. So I used to, I used to work for a recruitment agency for, um, for, and a bit years and I did their marketing and their graphic design. And, um, kind of got bored of it.

Anya Smith:
I'm

Jane Kisnica:
It's

Anya Smith:
sorry.

Jane Kisnica:
when you, when you work with the same, I'm, I need a lot to keep me entertained, um, and repeating the same tasks every day gets me bored really quickly. So. Um, during COVID that became really apparent that I was like, I'm not happy. I got time to sit down and think why I'm not happy. And I was like, okay, it's the job. I need to change something. I need, I need something new, something exciting. Realized I want to go freelance, but I want to go back to having my own, my own time back in my own sort of freedom and being able to do what I want when I want, not when someone tells me to. So I, um. In 2020 January I started posting on LinkedIn, which is kind of where it all happened. Um

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
yeah it was um it was it was a hard journey because I obviously when you first start there's crickets, no one pays attention to your content, no one comments, it's

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
you know punching the gut, your ego is like oh my god what is going on here. Um, but I kind of managed to stick through that, those few three, two, three months where there was nothing happening, then things started to pick up. And, um, then within six months of posting, kind of being active and trying to build my personal brand and actually trying to figure out what I, what I want to do with it, which direction I'm going to take it in, what I'm going to talk about kind of snowballed. And, um, I just woke up one morning and I was like, okay, I have so much work. I need to quit my job. I can't. I can't have a full-time job that I spend eight, nine hours a day on. And I can't keep doing the freelance work because I'm like, there's not enough hours in a day, not enough days in the week. So six months in posting on LinkedIn, I was giving my notice in my full-time job. And then from September, 2022, I went fully freelance and have been fully freelance since and been here.

Anya Smith:
So that's almost a year here, right? Almost

Jane Kisnica:
Yes,

Anya Smith:
a year

Jane Kisnica:
yeah, it will

Anya Smith:
coming

Jane Kisnica:
be,

Anya Smith:
up.

Jane Kisnica:
yeah, 31st August on the dot. That was my last working day, if it was a working day. I mean, it was August. August was my last month of, last year was my last month of full employment and then from 1st of September, I was officially freelance doing my own thing and kind of packing up my whole life and moving to Asia and doing all

Anya Smith:
Oof,

Jane Kisnica:
that stuff.

Anya Smith:
so much to unpack there and everybody listening on the 31st, congratulations Jane,

Jane Kisnica:
I'm sorry.

Anya Smith:
and a year on this amazing journey. But to get back a little bit to you and kind of how things formed, I think you mentioned that, you know, design wasn't necessarily the core component of your work at the previous job, right? But you made it, you're like, you know what? That's

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah,

Anya Smith:
what I actually

Jane Kisnica:
so

Anya Smith:
like to do.

Jane Kisnica:
I, yeah, so what, because I had time to, when COVID happened, I actually had time, because I was, I was one person doing all the marketing tasks, right? So I was photography, video, social media, websites, content, creation, design, everything, everything that you can think that goes under the marketing umbrella for a 50 plus people business I was in charge of. So I was always tired, I was always overworked and I didn't have that time to actually sit with myself and my thoughts and kind of think about what do I like? What do I don't like? Am I happy? Am I content

Anya Smith:
Yeah,

Jane Kisnica:
with what I'm doing,

Anya Smith:
yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
where I'm at in life? And then COVID happened and all that really slowed down. And so I've read Simon Sinek's, starting with Y and that That kind of blew my mind open. I was like, oh my God, I hate my job. I need to change this. And that kind of, then I started sitting thinking, okay, what do I, this aspects of my job that I like and there's aspects of my job that I don't like. So I didn't like the marketing side because it's all numbers and spreadsheets and, and 12 month plans up ahead. I don't know what I'm going to be doing next week. Not to mention trying to figure out what to do with. with marketing for the next, it's just not, it's just not how I function. I don't,

Anya Smith:
Right.

Jane Kisnica:
I don't enjoy it. It just causes me anxiety. Um, so I, and then I've realized that, okay, I don't like the marketing side of things, but I actually really like the design side of things because when I'm designing, I'm really happy. I'm kind of in my, you know, in my zone, I'm enjoying it. I make, gives me a lot of joy when I, when someone gives me a word document full of texts and I create something visually. stunning from it and they go, oh my god, thank you so much. And even more so if they come back and go, oh my god, you know what you created for me help me close a client or bring in leads or whatever it might be that they were trying to achieve with that design. So Then I started thinking, okay, I don't think I'm that good because obviously I've I'm self taught. I haven't gone to uni or anything. I fell into a job by an accident. It just happens. I learned everything from YouTube and going to courses and doing online courses and that sort of stuff. So I didn't go.

Anya Smith:
Pretty much the same thing.

Jane Kisnica:
To be honest...

Anya Smith:
I have two degrees and I'm like, it's still very much like self-taught, you know, that's the value there.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, like I've, I know some people who are doing a design degree right now and it's the way it's a waste of time. You could learn all that. You could learn that and more in a year and probably pay about 500 quid for it for online courses. That's another topic. Um, um, but, um, yeah, so I, I started just picking up some extra skills, spending my free time, just learning about logo design and branding and. and just designing for a wider sort of range of businesses and things like that. Because when I was working for the recruitment agency, I could design for them while I was asleep because I was so used to, it's all the same thing, right? It's

Anya Smith:
Right?

Jane Kisnica:
the same layouts, the same branding, the same everything. So I kind of started honing my skills and then dealing with my mindset as well, because there was a lot of scarcity mindset involved. Because my original thoughts were like, Who's going to pay me? Like there's so many designers out there. It's such a saturated sector area. Like how, how am I even, and I'm not, I don't think I'm that good. Um, how am I going to make this work? So there was a lot of mindset work on my part that I needed to deal with. So I got some coaching. I read a lot of books and listened to podcasts and did all the things that you do, right, to get over, um, some negative. toxic mindsets that you might have acquired. And yeah, then slowly kind of just all evolved and came together and then LinkedIn happened because I tried on Instagram in the beginning. That was a waste of time. I was on there for about six months, didn't get a single job. And then LinkedIn kind of came in and then on six months on LinkedIn and I was quitting my job because I had so much freelance work that I didn't know what to do with it. So, yeah, that's kind of. Short story.

Anya Smith:
I love that. I love that. And I'm going to unpack some parts of it because there's definitely a lot of things I want to dive into. But one thing that stood out to me was the reflection piece. And I find it ironic, not necessarily good or bad, is that we get so busy in our life, like without intention. We follow this path like, oh, well, I fell into this job. You know, whatever that is. And like, okay, I should be happy. You know, I'm in a stable job. I'm doing something. That's right. But then you realize at a point of slowing down, like, I'm not actually happy.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, yeah. Cause we just, we don't, we don't like, we're usually so busy that we don't have that time to actually sit with our own thoughts. And a lot of people actually avoid that. They hate being by themselves. They avoid spending time with themselves and their thoughts because they don't, they don't want to know what's actually going on in their head.

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
And for me, it was more that I was just always so, cause I'm an introvert as well. So for me going to the office and dealing with people. and the travel there and the travel back. That's incredibly exhausting. So by the time doing that five days a week, getting up 5.30 in the morning, being in the office for 8 a.m., not getting home till probably 6.30, 7 p.m., five days a week, that was excruciatingly exhausting for me. But I haven't realized that. I haven't even realized how tired I was because then COVID came and I didn't have to go into the office and I was like, oh, I actually have so much more energy now that I don't have to. go into the office every day or, you know, do all the travel and getting up so early and all that. So it just, yeah, it kind of helped me just realize that there was a lot of things that weren't actually working for me as a human being, but I haven't had the energy or the time to realize what wasn't working and why wasn't it working and that there is maybe a different way of doing things.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, and I'm curious, since you had that reflection, I think that initial reflection adds a little more curiosity to the point after that point. Is there now more reflection that you try to have as you're doing your work, after that initial point, oh, this is not working for me? Have you carried on that curiosity and reflection as part of your day-to-day now that you are doing this and you're doing it well and thriving? Is that still helpful for you?

Jane Kisnica:
Oh absolutely, yeah, you have to. Because when you run your own business, you kind of have to do it because you have to realize what works, what doesn't work, what makes you money, what doesn't make you money. So you kind of have to always be in that reflection mindset because if you're not, then you're not really gonna grow, you're not gonna develop, you're kind of just gonna be stuck in. in a single place and I have, and I have times I have some weeks that are really busy and I barely have time to sleep and eat and do anything else but work. But then other the week after it will be a lot, a lot more calmer. And then I can again, sit down and think, okay, well, you know, maybe if something went wrong with a client or whatever the week before I can then sit down and kind of mull over it and think, okay, maybe it could improve my onboarding process. Or maybe I need to ask some more questions. Or maybe there's another thing that I need to work on or change or improve or remove or add or whatever it might be in my processes that would help me avoid that mistake. Or, you know, if for example, a client comes back and doesn't like my work, I can sit down and think, okay, could I have done the onboarding better? Could I have asked better questions? Was this just me having a bad day? and not having the right creative mindset for this job. That's why it didn't turn out. Or is it just the client? Cause sometimes you get clients, doesn't matter how good you are. They're not going to be happy and they won't be able to tell you what the problem is and all that. So that's another thing to deal with. So you kind of need to process all of this. Go, is it

Anya Smith:
Right.

Jane Kisnica:
me? Is it them? Is it something I did? Is it something that they did or didn't do? So this, yeah, this, I think it's just with business. You have to, you have to reflect. and look back at things all the time. When you work for someone else, I almost feel like they do it for you because you have your like quarterly check-ins and then, you know, you just sit down and write things on paper or discuss your last three months or whatever. And you kind of don't have to reflect and think about things as much because everything just kind of, it just happens and most things are the same every day. Most processes are the same. So yeah, it's very different, I think.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, and I love like all of that. But I think the mindset piece is really important on a variety of things that you mentioned. So from this, like the reflective piece is so important because you mentioned, we talked about mental health a little bit earlier on. And I think that where mental health can get really difficult is when we turn, we step away from being curious and reflective to being judgmental of ourselves. Instead of like, oh, this didn't go well, I am X, Y, Z. in a negative connotation to like, okay, this didn't go well. What let's get curious and how can I make it better? And if today was shit for whatever reason, how can we make it better and not make it about who I am as a human being? But more like, okay, there's this is a problem to be solved. And we just get curious about it.

Jane Kisnica:
big time especially as a creative I imagine that every doesn't matter if you're a designer videographer or copyright or whatever you are I feel like you really have to learn to separate yourself from the work which is a lot of you have to work with yourself and kind of always have to remind yourself okay they didn't like my work but this is not a reflection on me as a human it doesn't make me a bad human or not worthy or or terrible or whatever it might be, it's just, it's just, they didn't like the work. Creative work, whatever you create and put out in the world is very subjective. So people will see it differently. Some people will love it. Some people will hate it. Some people won't feel anything about it. So you kind of need to learn to separate yourself from that. So otherwise it's gonna be really hard. And I'm like,

Anya Smith:
Yeah,

Jane Kisnica:
it's really,

Anya Smith:
yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
it's hard because I am, I hate, I hate. When someone doesn't like what I've done, it really upsets me. Um, I get

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
really emotional, so I really have to learn to not let it ruin my day or ruin my week or whatever. I have to really learn to control the emotions because I, with depression and anxiety that I have, something can happen and I can mull it over for the next week and it might stop me from sleeping. and performing properly, because I'm just constantly obsessed about this one thing that went wrong. So I've found ways how to sort of detach myself from negative feedback, from, I don't know, people not liking my content or not liking my work or whatever it is, because I don't want it, I don't want my work to affect my mental health in that type, in that sort of degree where I can't sleep or... It just stresses me out and I can't enjoy life or do good work for my other clients because someone else didn't like what I've done for them.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, thank you, A, for being vulnerable and sharing that. And to your point, I think like our mental, we undervalue sometimes our mental health, but it has correlation to everything, right? Like our bodies feel it, right? Like I usually get like an upset stomach, the moment, like the mental health and anxiety, like I'm like, oh my gosh, like always upset stomach, like just, yeah, uncomfortable feelings. And like you don't function the same way because of something that's in our head. And it's easy to say, okay, we'll just forget about it. but it's not easy to mentally get there. It takes that repetition

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah,

Anya Smith:
and work.

Jane Kisnica:
absolutely. I think it takes repetition, takes work. And also you can't, with negative feelings and emotions, you have to feel them and get through them and deal with them. And very often it's helpful to actually understand why it's making you feel like that. Cause if someone tells me they don't like my work, it's usually my inner child starts having a tantrum and go, and is thrown back to school where I was bullied, I wasn't liked, and I wasn't the popular kid. I was the geek who was picked on. So it like brings up some form of childhood trauma that I haven't quite dealt with. And that also helps you kind of go, okay, this is not actually about that person and about them not liking my work. This is more about some sort of earlier year trauma being pulled up to the surface. And sometimes you can't figure out what it is, but even if you do have that pause and you go, oh, this probably has nothing to do, me getting upset about this has nothing to do with this person not liking my work, but it's something that's going on up here that I need to process. It just helps me, at least it helps me. I don't know if it helps everyone, but for me, like if I had knowledge that, yeah, this is probably

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
my ego being bruised and my inner child having a tantrum. because someone didn't like what they did, it helps me kind of squish down those upset feelings and just mellow out a bit and not be as affected by it as I used to.

Anya Smith:
Well,

Jane Kisnica:
Because

Anya Smith:
I think you're cool.

Jane Kisnica:
I hate when people don't like my work. And it hurts me, it's like, how dare you?

Anya Smith:
We're still human and I think you're cool. And I was a foreign kid growing up and I don't think of myself as cool ever. And that's okay. I was chubby. I went to different schools, including different countries. I remember being called fat in Spanish at a new school. And that's okay because it made me who I am today and that's fine. But I totally can get that. And what I think personally, nothing really related to the podcast is I try to see emotions as they're protecting us, right? Like sometimes the negative emotions, they're not really there. I don't try to look at them as like, well, you are against me. A lot of times I try to find like, what are they trying to protect in me?

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah.

Anya Smith:
Right, and they're usually trying to protect some kind of discomfort.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, it's discomfort. It's a, it's some sort of trigger that you haven't quite dealt with. It's, you know, some trauma that the situation's reminding you of from, from your younger days, whatever. It's, yeah, it's usually about, it's usually about something, it's usually about us. And it's usually about something completely different than what the actual thing is that is upsetting us.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, you know what's funny? I was talking to my mom and we had the subject the other day, but she was giving me feedback on the podcast, which in itself is amazing. Anytime somebody is willing to give you authentic feedback, like that's a gift, take it. But I, in myself, was like, mm,

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah.

Anya Smith:
but that requires me to change something that I'm doing right now. And I'm, mm, but

Jane Kisnica:
Perfect,

Anya Smith:
you know,

Jane Kisnica:
how dare you?

Anya Smith:
but it was my ego and I was like,

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah

Anya Smith:
that's funny. Like if I wanna be any good at what I do, this is where I need to change. This is where I need to be catching that emotion of being rigid and there's no successful business. That's like, you know what? We've always done it the same. That's been really

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah,

Anya Smith:
successful

Jane Kisnica:
no,

Anya Smith:
for us always.

Jane Kisnica:
that's like, that's such a red flag, right? Yeah, you just have to, you have to learn to not take it personally. And also, like for me, it also depends how you deliver the feedback. If it's constructive, if it's, what's the words, constructive and like applicable and delivered in a nice manner. I'm like, okay, kind of. kind of hurts, but sure it makes sense. If it's delivered in like an abrupt, rude way where it's like an attack on you, an attack on the work, and I have had clients who will like, you know, take the piss out of the work because they don't like a particular element or, you know, try to be funny, but it's not funny. It's just insulting. Like you didn't have to insult the work. You just need to tell me what it is that doesn't work for you and I'll change it. You don't have to go into... Um, insult mode. So that that's when it, that's when it stings a lot more, but it's almost more anger than, than anything else. Like it's more of like, how dare you. But, um, yeah, you have to, it's just the more you do it, the more. I think it becomes easier as well. Cause I still, I still get upset. I'm not like perfect, but I definitely react. in a very different way than I did when I first started out. Because when I first started out, if someone said some, didn't like something or gave me some feedback, it would be like, I wouldn't say anything to the person, but internally, it would like, it would take me two days to get over it. And I would be like upset about it and angry and couldn't sleep because I'm thinking it over in my head

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
when I'm going to bed and all that. So yeah, the more I did it, the more I'm doing it, the better I'm becoming with dealing with all those emotions and kind of remind. that it's not about you, it's not an attack on you. Sometimes it probably is like but it's like 1% out of 100 where someone maybe is actually being insulting towards you but 99% of the time it's nothing to do with you, it's not a personal attack, it's just an opinion. We all

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
have different opinions you just need to accept that and move on and do whatever you need to do to make them work better.

Anya Smith:
Absolutely, I'd be sure again you always being authentic which is evident in everything you do One thing I don't know if it helps like I try to think of like how people act as usually a bigger reflection of them Than you

Jane Kisnica:
Mmm.

Anya Smith:
so like I think a lot of times people like we're horrible giving feedback Even if we although I do believe like we feel the intention of the other human being like so if you're trying to be difficult Trust that like don't be nice and say all the nice thing be kind and say something truthful That's gonna help the other person. But if somebody is being shitty to you That's probably a reflection of their inability.

Jane Kisnica:
Absolutely, absolutely. It is like communication on someone is a skill, right? And so, and a lot of people do not have that skill, especially working in design and learn more and more that a lot of people actually can't express what it is that they want or what it is that they don't like or why or whatever. It's very hard for people to express themselves. And when someone does go down to insulting others, It is usually. I'm not gonna bring politics into this. Unless you're like a really, really horrible person who deserves it, the person shall not be named who I'm thinking about right now, but he's our agent, has white hair. Unless you really do deserve it in a way and you are horrible to others and you kind of bringing that energy back onto you, it will, 99% of the time again, it will be about the other person. and not about you. Every time I get a nasty comment on LinkedIn,

Anya Smith:
Hmm.

Jane Kisnica:
someone argumentative or just being horrible, not liking my content, whatever, I always remind myself that it's not, it's not about me. This is not nothing to like, no, no happy person and no content person will go online and just spread hate

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
and be nasty to people they don't know to complete strangers. for the sake of being nasty, there's usually an underlying issue there, unhappiness, trauma, whatever it might be that is causing the person to act that way, but it's nothing to do with me because they don't even know me, so why...

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
Unless I'm going and openly spreading hate towards whatever group of people or whatever, like... being hateful towards me because you don't like the post that I did doesn't really reflect on me, it reflects on you.

Anya Smith:
Absolutely, absolutely. And I think that you, in a way, as you grow your social presence, unfortunately, there will be people who see that as a platform to get attention. And I think also being a woman, and looking sort of like, we also, I'm not saying I'm projecting that myself, but even I, as a mom, get uncomfortable posts, not even sexual, but demanding my attention or something like that. It's interesting kind of the reactions we get when you put yourself socially out there when you're trying to do good. And people just have all their own backgrounds and you have to weigh that. And we talk about that a lot, but I'm just making that side comment because I think besides even nasty comments, there's things that women have to do that are just trying to do good in the world that I don't think many others have to. But

Jane Kisnica:
Oh yeah,

Anya Smith:
that's a whole

Jane Kisnica:
absolutely.

Anya Smith:
different subject.

Jane Kisnica:
Absolutely. The middle-aged white man complex of wanting to, um, mansplain a woman online or wanting to argue with a woman about a subject they know nothing about, but they'll still argue about it and still try to make you put in your, put you in your place and like make you feel bad about it or like you don't know what you're talking about. I don't get it a lot, but I get... like I'll probably get a couple of months where I'm just like here we go again here's another one

Anya Smith:
Yeah, and it's

Jane Kisnica:
and

Anya Smith:
hard

Jane Kisnica:
it's

Anya Smith:
if you're

Jane Kisnica:
always

Anya Smith:
human. Yeah, go

Jane Kisnica:
it's

Anya Smith:
ahead, sorry.

Jane Kisnica:
always a middle-aged middle-class white man every single time I very rarely get any hate or negativity or just weird argumentative stuff from women it happens very rarely it's always a middle-aged white man

Anya Smith:
Okay,

Jane Kisnica:
he wants

Anya Smith:
I'm

Jane Kisnica:
to

Anya Smith:
gonna

Jane Kisnica:
do.

Anya Smith:
take the vibe to like, thank you for visit. And if you can like, it's important, like sincerely, like there's times where like, I love this platform and everything that I'm doing. And I feel like I'm doing good in the world connecting people like with Jane, which is inspiring. And then there's time like, why does somebody have this in their life to bring you down? And I

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah.

Anya Smith:
can reflect on like, it's not me, it's them dealing with their own like, and I have sincerely struggled with that. Cause like, I'm like, how do I build people up? Like, how do you give people the chance? But like, I'm learning to also trust my instinct around people who like. reach out or have expectations. And if it doesn't feel good, and if you're listening to this, like honor the feelings that you have about

Jane Kisnica:
Absolutely,

Anya Smith:
people

Jane Kisnica:
trust

Anya Smith:
reaching

Jane Kisnica:
your gut.

Anya Smith:
out, what you're doing. Very

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah,

Anya Smith:
powerful.

Jane Kisnica:
and just don't engage. Like my, with any sort of hate, I just don't engage. I just delete and block.

Anya Smith:
Yeah. And

Jane Kisnica:
I

Anya Smith:
I don't

Jane Kisnica:
used

Anya Smith:
even

Jane Kisnica:
to engage,

Anya Smith:
hate.

Jane Kisnica:
but now I'm just like, I don't have time for this. Like they, again, it's not about me, it's about them. So I might as well just save myself stress and not

Anya Smith:
Love that.

Jane Kisnica:
engage. And it's just, it's sadly, it is what comes with social media. The more you put, as I said, you know, the more you put yourself out there. The more you grow your following, the more people see your content, the more you're gonna bring in some sort of negativity. As much as it sucks, you kind of need to be ready to deal with that.

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
Because it doesn't matter who you are, it doesn't matter how nice you are, it doesn't matter what content you post, there will be someone who's gonna hate on you. And that's it. It's just how the world works, sadly.

Anya Smith:
And just interject something completely random into your content for no reason, just like prove their own point. But anyhow, I do want to pivot a little bit, but I love this genuine discussion. And I hope it's helpful for everybody listening who may be seeing something different, just want to have validation in that perspective, because I don't think we talk about this a lot, honestly, and it's sad because it's happening. But to talk about your start of the journey, you mentioned that for the first couple of months, crickets, right? And that's really hard. Like not only are you taking a step in like, I really wanna do this, I find this exciting. And that you're like, I'm gonna take over the world kind of phase, right? When you start. And then it can be really challenging to keep putting in the work and your heart and soul into something where you're not seeing the output. Can you share a little

Jane Kisnica:
Mmm.

Anya Smith:
bit more like, what helped you have that confidence and resilience throughout that time?

Jane Kisnica:
So for me it was... I just, I had, again, a mindset thing, right? I thought about, okay, I've been doing this, this is not working, but I know that these, because I've worked in social media, I know how these things work, I know how these things can take time. So I reminded myself that I need to stick at it, and that at some point it will work and it will happen. And... reminded myself that the scariest thing for me was not, not getting the likes or the engagement to feed my ego, but it was being stuck in a job that I don't wanna be in. So that was kind of my driving force. Cause I was like, I want to get out and I'm gonna do whatever it takes to get out and build a life that I want. And that just, yeah, kind of, I just function on fear, I guess. It's just it helped me, cause every

Anya Smith:
Ha ha!

Jane Kisnica:
time the fear. The thought of still being stuck in a nine to five job, five, 10, 15 years from now, dealing with all the corporate bullshit and all the games and all the stuff that you need to deal with to get a promotion, to get a salary raised, to ask for permission, to go on holiday, all these things. I just reminded myself that that's my biggest fear and I don't want to, apart from dying, that's my biggest fear. Second biggest fear is me. being stuck in an office job doing a job that I don't want to do just to pay bills. And that, that got me through, through those love moments, just remembering why I'm doing this, what I'm doing this for, and then there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Because obviously, if you're doing it for 12 months and nothing's happening, you probably need to rethink your strategy and rethink what you're doing and how you're approaching it, your topics, how you're showing up online and everything. But- It does take time. So I reminded myself, okay, I've been doing this for two, three months. It's crickets. Mostly my colleagues liking my posts and then taking the piss out of me after they have read it. I was like, I'm just going to keep doing it. I've seen people succeed. I know what you can do with, with LinkedIn. I know how, how you can grow a successful business. I have seen it happen. I have friends who have done it. I've like, yeah, it was just. getting over myself really, and not letting that ego drag me down and stop me from posting and kind of pursuing something that I wanted to pursue.

Anya Smith:
I think that's so powerful. Like a lot of things, like again, what drives you? Like being very clear, whatever it is. And it's okay to have the fear of like regret. I think about it all the time. Like things I want to do and I'm like, but I will regret not doing it. And I'm like, okay, then

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah,

Anya Smith:
we're doing

Jane Kisnica:
yeah.

Anya Smith:
this. We're doing this.

Jane Kisnica:
I always remind myself, you're gonna regret the things that you didn't do, not the things that you did do, because at least if you do something, you're like, okay, well this didn't work, or this wasn't for me, or I didn't enjoy that so I'm not gonna do it again, but at least I know. And you probably learned something from it as well, from doing it. At least the minimum you learned that, oh it didn't work this way, or I didn't like it, or whatever it might be. There's always a lesson from- any situation that you can take away.

Anya Smith:
It was funny, people say, try anything once, and I'm like, try anything twice. Because

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah.

Anya Smith:
if you try it the first time, and then like, there's a chance it was a, whatever, it was a faulty situation, right? But there's so much we miss in life, and we don't try at all, or like make a quick judgment, and then avoid whatever it is. And this is broadly sweet food, whatever. Like, again, the whole point is to experience life, and don't make quick judgments, or avoid situations in general that avoid you from experiencing things.

Jane Kisnica:
Absolutely, I totally agree. And like life is short, right? So we might as well do all the things and experience and do as many things as we want. Like that was another thing. I want to see the world and you can't do that when you work in an office because you're stuck two to three weeks of holiday a year and you can't really go anywhere. Like

Anya Smith:
In

Jane Kisnica:
where

Anya Smith:
the

Jane Kisnica:
can

Anya Smith:
UK,

Jane Kisnica:
you go?

Anya Smith:
imagine the US, you have one week. Most people have one crappy week of holiday.

Jane Kisnica:
That is, I just, I can't, that just like, it actually fills me with like dread to think that, to live a life like that. Um, cause yeah, travel, travel was another thing that pushed me towards it. Cause I was like, I want to travel. I want to have my freedom. I want to live where I want to live. not where my job makes me to live because I want to see the world. I want to experience. There's so much to see in the world. It's so small but it's so big. There's so much going on. There's so many beautiful places and I was like I want to see it all and that was another drive for me that pushed me through those crickets months was yeah I want to get out of the office. I want to travel. I want to have my freedom back. I want to be in charge of my life, in charge of my income and not be... not have it dictated by someone else. Like I've, yeah, yeah.

Anya Smith:
And if you don't mind me mentioning here, you had a beautiful story of your tattoos that also kind of goes through this journey. Do you mind mentioning that here?

Jane Kisnica:
No, not at all. So, um, when I started, when I decided that I'm going to go freelance and I'm going to make it happen, I didn't quite know which direction I'm going to take and how it's going to go. But it was like in my head, I was like, okay, I made a decision. I'm going to make this happen. Usually when that happens, I make things happen no matter what stubborn like that.

Anya Smith:
Love it, love it.

Jane Kisnica:
So I got this tattoo on my left hand, and it was I was like a promise to myself that I will never go back to the corporate world and that I will get out because I did work in an office, yes, but we had quite lax, you know, rules about tattoos and things like how you were dressing. So it was kind of a relaxed environment. But it was this was to me like a promise to myself that I'm going to get out and I'm never going to go back and I'm going to make it happen no matter what. Um, and also a lot of people wouldn't hire me with this on my head. And so it was,

Anya Smith:
I'm sorry.

Jane Kisnica:
I'm just, I'm just, just like, there's no other choice. Right. Um, so that was that. And then once I got out and I went freelance and came over to Asia and I was in Bali in the beginning for a few months, I got my other hand done. Um, and that was, that was more of a, you did it, you got out. You made it happen. and this is your path now sort of thing. So they're both, they're just both reminders for me why I'm doing it, why I did it, and what got me to where I am now. So they're kind of, yeah.

Anya Smith:
And they're gorgeous and for anybody who's on the podcast and on the YouTube you have like beautiful lotus tattoos And they have like little elements that go on your fingers just in case they're

Jane Kisnica:
Oh my-

Anya Smith:
hearing

Jane Kisnica:
oh

Anya Smith:
this

Jane Kisnica:
yeah. Yeah, there's-

Anya Smith:
And there's a little close-up so check it out on YouTube if

Jane Kisnica:
There's

Anya Smith:
you

Jane Kisnica:
all- there's

Anya Smith:
if you

Jane Kisnica:
all

Anya Smith:
want

Jane Kisnica:
sorts going on.

Anya Smith:
I Love that I love the element like see what you wear where you want to be too And I think that tattoo in this case was a manifestation, I am doing this and I'm seeing this reminder for me daily. You know what's funny, when I launched this podcast, I was just like, who knew what I would be doing? But I made a t-shirt. I made a t-shirt with the logo, the logo that wasn't even used right now, but it was my quick couple days of work. I'm just gonna put it in front of me so I see something and I got the microphone and I was like, I don't know how to use it, which is evident

Jane Kisnica:
Mmm.

Anya Smith:
in some of my episodes that came out.

Jane Kisnica:
I'm gonna go to bed.

Anya Smith:
I should have Googled that. But like I was like, I'm not gonna stop and like lose the momentum and just wait for permission or whatever or validation or get perfect. I'm like, I am just going to learn and have something in front of me that like makes me look the part.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, I love that. I love and there's a really like mood boards, manifestation, all that it works. I don't believe in manifestation to the degree where you sit on your ass and you're living or in watching Netflix and waiting for millions to fall on your lap. That's not going to happen. But

Anya Smith:
Darn

Jane Kisnica:
I do

Anya Smith:
it.

Jane Kisnica:
believe you have the, if you have the right mindset and you do the actions, the right actions that can take you to where you want to be, it does work. Because I have gone through mind-shift changes. For example, just before things took off for me, I had quite a heavy scarcity mindset still. And I wrote a book, I can't remember the author now, but I think it's called, You're a Badass at Making Money. I think it's Jennifer or something, Sirocco or something like that. Can't remember what her name was now, but I've read that book and it really helped me. It helped me get over my scarcity mindset because all she talks about the scarcity mindset and I am spiritual. So she involves a lot of spiritual elements into that as well. So it really helped me. Switch how I was looking at many how I was looking at getting clients. I didn't I didn't look at it anymore. Like oh where I'm going to get clients like there's not enough. Now I look at it like there's a billion people in. world, nearly 8 billion, right? I only need a few to make a living each month to make good money. And if I want to make more money, I just need to hold my skill, get better, charge more, get better clients. It's all out there. It's all available to me. I just need to have the right, put out the right energy and have the right mindset for it. And literally within like a month, things just changed. As soon as I switched that mindset and got rid of that scarcity, it's still there. It's not completely gone, but I look at it in a very, very different way now. And like money and how I spend it and how I save it and everything. But it just, it just changed completely. So I do believe that when you have the right mindset and you focus on the right things, things happen. Things do happen. Things do come and things do work out.

Anya Smith:
I completely believe that. And I just Googled it as we're talking. Jen Sincero, I

Jane Kisnica:
Yes,

Anya Smith:
might be butchering

Jane Kisnica:
yes,

Anya Smith:
her

Jane Kisnica:
there

Anya Smith:
last

Jane Kisnica:
we

Anya Smith:
name,

Jane Kisnica:
go.

Anya Smith:
but

Jane Kisnica:
I was very close.

Anya Smith:
I love that. I love all books that have some kind of punny thing or kind of edgy thing to it. Like, Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck was a good book for me too, and it's really about owning your own life. You are in charge, but anything that has any kind of swear words in it has my heart.

Jane Kisnica:
Oh, same, yeah, same. I have a point now.

Anya Smith:
You know what's funny? If you see my episodes, you might be like, Anya, why did you rate this explicit? There was nothing explicit. Because I don't remember sometimes what episodes we swore in. I was like, just to be safe. Because I want to be sure we can do that.

Jane Kisnica:
Because you can say one swear word and then you have to rate it as unsafe because otherwise they're going to take it down or whatever, so might as well.

Anya Smith:
It's like, let's always be authentic. On that subject, what I love about your content is it has so much, it's just fun. I read your content, even on important things, you have this very personable story, you have a way to write it, even your description. Just read the about section of Jane. It's just fun. I like how you mentioned something about if you're not from this 80s or something, using email, go to my DM. Just how he described things.

Jane Kisnica:
Thank

Anya Smith:
He's

Jane Kisnica:
you.

Anya Smith:
like, oh, she just, you feel your spirit. through your text because it's, I'm sure it's not easy. It takes thought and effort to get there, but like

Jane Kisnica:
Oh, absolutely.

Anya Smith:
there's a lot of authenticity throughout your whole work. So my question in there deeply buried is like, how did you learn to like be authentic throughout like the social space? Because I think it'd be challenging to show up authentically and be competent in that.

Jane Kisnica:
It is, it still is. I do still censor myself a little bit because if I actually spoke the way I spoke, I probably would be put in LinkedIn jail and never be let out.

Anya Smith:
We can be friends though.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, yeah, you're fair. But it just comes with time, I think. Again, everything involves around mindset, right? Do I really care about what some strangers online think about me? Maybe a little bit, yeah, but in the grand scheme of things, not so much. So if you don't like what I have to say or the way I talk, you're not my person, you're not my audience, you're not someone I want to work with. Like I always laugh when I don't get them a lot, but when I see comments like, Oh, I can't believe you said that I would never work with someone like that. I'm like- Good, because I don't want to work with you either if that's your attitude.

Anya Smith:
Win-win.

Jane Kisnica:
Like, win here, so I'm pushing. So I have found that if I'm very open about who I am as a person, what my values are, what I believe in, what I don't believe in, I push away the people that don't fit with my character and who I am as a person, and I attract the people who think the same as I do. So it helps avoiding working with people that I don't wanna work with. Sometimes some still sneak through, but overall, everyone who comes to me, I think they have a pretty good idea of who I am, how I work, how I talk, and how I behave. So yeah, it's almost like a filtering system for me, being me, being honest, and talking. The way I want to talk and express myself kind of pushes away the people who wouldn't agree with it. But if they don't agree with the way I am, I don't want to work with them anyway, so it doesn't matter. So that helps. Also, the older I get, the less fucks I give.

Anya Smith:
Yes, yeah, I usually I don't have enough flux for a day like I'm done and

Jane Kisnica:
I

Anya Smith:
my

Jane Kisnica:
just.

Anya Smith:
limit has been exceeded three kids. Yeah

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, I'm just like, I want to say what I want to say. I want to talk the way I want to talk. If you don't like it, like just move on. I don't care. There's enough people out there who do resonate with what I have to say with the way I am, with the way I say things. So it's just, yeah, you just need to care less. That's probably the takeaway here. And it is, and it is, it is hard because you have to, again, you have to detach your, your self-worth and kind of your, yourself from, from the content a little bit almost. So you don't care as much what, what will Karen in accounting say about this post? Like, do you, does, is Kat, is Karen someone you want to work with? Is Karen someone who will add to your, to your community, to your life? Probably not. So who? Who gives a fuck what Karen thinks? Apologies,

Anya Smith:
Although my

Jane Kisnica:
Karen's

Anya Smith:
mother-in-law

Jane Kisnica:
annoying

Anya Smith:
is Karen,

Jane Kisnica:
her all not bad.

Anya Smith:
my mother-in-law is Karen and I do care a lot.

Jane Kisnica:
No.

Anya Smith:
But besides that, for those other Karen, absolutely.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, yeah. So it's just like, even when I, you know, when I started, there were people even within the business that I was working in that would make some snarky comments, as I said, take the piss out of my content. And some would be like, Oh, you shouldn't say that or you shouldn't post that. I'm like, I don't care. I'm not posting this for you. This is like, this is not for you, like, why do you care? I don't care, why do you care? People just care too much, people care too much, but everyone else is gonna think about them and I think that's what stops a lot of people being themselves and expressing themselves the way they want to, but it's not actually as scary as it might seem, because most people don't care about you, like, at all.

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
They care about themselves, about their own problems, about their own lives and whatever you might say online, it's like... It's in through one ear and out through the other and they've forgotten about it five minutes later when you're probably still thinking about it two days later. So it's just you have to yeah you have to care less.

Anya Smith:
I absolutely agree. And what's funny about that is that, sorry, I was spacing out here for a moment. I had an idea and it blew by. I'll think about it. We'll get back to this. One thing I did want to ask was about like, now you're living in Bangkok and you're doing something that you love and I can see just how much energy and passion you have about this. But I always love to ask on the positive side of all the hard work, like what to you right now is like your success journey? and kind of like, how are you rewarding yourself now that you've kind of reached a level of foundation where you're doing things on your own term? Like, what can that path of like challenges and perseverance and learning and not giving a fuck lead to is what I'm asking you right now. And kind of what maybe is now your big scary goal at this point.

Jane Kisnica:
I don't know what my big scary goal is. I'm not big on setting goals. I like I have a direction and Obviously, I want to grow my business. I want to make more money. I want to help my mom pay her mortgage on her house. Things like that. Maybe buy an apartment in Asia somewhere. So I have like sort of Sort of goals and directions I want to go in but I don't have like oh I want to be making this much and bye 2024 January the first and I don't function like that but all the work that I have put in has just given me the freedom to first of all work with people that I want to work with if you're giving me stress and anxiety I'm going to fire you I don't care um so I have that now which I obviously didn't when you work in an office you might not gel with people but you still have to pretend like you do because you don't have a choice unless they leave or you leave. I make more money so I don't have a ceiling on my income. I just if I want to make more I just need to charge more and work harder. I feel financially free. I have... the biggest financial freedom I've ever had. I have saved the most money I've ever saved. I feel confident. Even if work, for example, does slow down for a few weeks, I know that I'm financially stable and in a good place, and that things are not gonna fall apart, and I don't have to stress about it. So I don't have that anxiety around money anymore. And then just general freedom. I moved to Bangkok, because I wanted to spend a year in Bangkok and see maybe I wanted... live here again much longer. I can go on holidays every few weeks or every other month or whatever. I can go out and do things that I want and just, you know, if I need to, even just from the freedom perspective, if I need to go and see a doctor, I don't have to ask anyone. I just go and see a doctor. If I don't feel like working on a Monday, I don't work on a Monday. Yeah, I'll have to work a bit harder on Tuesday and Wednesday to catch up. But if I'm not feeling it, I don't have to force myself. If I want to go and see out a friend for Brain-Tron on Tuesday at 12, I can do it. So I have all this, yeah, it's just freedom. For me, freedom has always been the main goal with this. This is why I started posting on LinkedIn, building my personal brand and freelancing, because I wanted the freedom. In my head, I was even, even if I make less money than I did at my full-time job... At least I have the freedom. I can move and live somewhere cheaper. That is not London. There's no extortionate. Jesus Christ, London prices. I just can't. And you, um, yeah, I just, I just have the freedom to do things my way. And I've always wanted that. And that's what I have now. That is, to me, that's the ultimate success. Because no one can tell me how to be, how to dress, where to be, when to work, how to work. I decide these things and that's to me, that's everything that I wanted.

Anya Smith:
That's awesome. I love seeing the true kind of the journey and the challenges and now like where it gets you. The thing I meant to say earlier about like authenticity and I forgot because I was like, I'm just thinking

Jane Kisnica:
Thanks for watching!

Anya Smith:
about this awesome reply you had was like, whenever we try to be something different or emulate somebody else because we like they are so good. I need to be like, we're only at best going to be second best to do anything that we try to replicate. Or if we're not authentic, that means we don't have a foundation people can actually truly connect to. Like we're more authentic, those connections are genuine from other people. And that's how you build your tribe and your little thought. Like anything else in that, like doesn't quite make that audience resonate with you fully. They're like, well, this is not quite like, I don't feel the full uniqueness of this person. So anything

Jane Kisnica:
Absolutely.

Anya Smith:
to support the authenticity

Jane Kisnica:
And

Anya Smith:
of what? Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
it's exhausting as well. Like I always say, learn from the best, learn from the 1%. Take away bits and because I've taken bits and pieces from different creators, Leah Turner, Luke Matthews, you know, all these big copywriters and people on LinkedIn. I take bits away from them, but I pick and choose. I'm like, oh, I like what he's doing there or what she's doing there. I can do that. I know that's going to work for me. Or I test things and go, oh. this worked for me or this thing that this other creator did flopped and didn't work. So I'm just going to, you know, move on to the next. So I think it's you learn, study and take the good stuff away, but don't try to be someone else, try to kind of copy someone else. Exactly. Because that's just not it's exhausting and it's not going to it's not going to work.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, you're not going to enjoy it. This is meant to be fun, right?

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah.

Anya Smith:
One thing I wanted to ask you, I'm looking at the time, and I want to be like, I'm very curious, you're an introvert. And so even this, I'm so grateful for you doing this, but it's not easy. And you mentioned this, how much it takes your energy. How have you learned to balance that? And also embrace it, because it's not a negative. There's superpower to be an introvert, too, the things that you can do that other people can't. So how

Jane Kisnica:
Mm.

Anya Smith:
do you balance your true self as an introvert in the work that you're doing to make it? right for you.

Jane Kisnica:
Um, I just, I, it's different every day. It just depends on my energy levels and how I feel some days. If I don't feel like going on LinkedIn and engaging, I won't. If I don't feel like posting, I'm not going to post. Um, I have, um, I only take calls four times a week. So Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Fridays, Saturday, Sundays, I don't take calls. Um, so yeah, I just kind of. I see how I feel on the day. There's, there's no balance. There's no balance when you run your own business. Sometimes you have to get over, like get over yourself. Like when you don't feel like getting on client calls, I still do it. I hype myself up before I kind of go, okay, let's, let's do, it's only going to be half an hour. Come on, you can do this. So sometimes you just need to do the stuff that you don't want to do. And for me again, it's just a driving fear of, okay, well, if I don't feel like showing up, Wellington, if I don't show up, my engagement goes down, my work goes down. Everything gets affected by it. If, if I don't do these types of things, you know, go on podcasts or networking calls or whatever it might be, it affects my business and affects my chances of growing and making more money. And it increases the possibility of me needing to go back to a 9-5 and I never want to do that. So to me, even though I am an extra- I'm sorry, introvert, and it's hard for me to do extroverted things

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
a lot, and you need to do that a lot when you run your own business, to me that's a lesser evil than going back to a 9-5. So again, I just, I function on fear and remind myself, well if you don't get on this call, you don't do this. there's more possibility that you need to go back to an office job because you're not gonna be getting work. So that's sort of how I deal with it. It might not be the most healthiest thing but it works right now, so.

Anya Smith:
No, but you also mentioned before you jumped in the field, you also mentioned the balance of knowing yourself and energy and balance it out. And so like, I think you're not functioning at the extreme of just like fear driving you all the time, but like having that balance. I'm like, this is where, this is the intention and this is what I wanna honor and this is the consequences and I'm following that path. Like I don't see you being living in like paralyzing fear either.

Jane Kisnica:
No,

Anya Smith:
Ha ha

Jane Kisnica:
no,

Anya Smith:
ha.

Jane Kisnica:
not at all. No, it's just, I always, when I don't want to do something, because most times I don't want to get on calls. I don't want to go on LinkedIn and talk to people. I don't want to do all these things, but I remind myself that you need to do these things because you have all these things that you want to do with your life. And in order to do those things, you need to do the things that you don't want. Um, and then

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
in the end, usually. When I get on the calls or go to the networking event or whatever I do, I do enjoy it in the end. It's just the before is like, oh, I just want to sit on my sofa and my PJs. I don't want to put on makeup or clothes or pants. Like that's kind of just getting,

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
getting over myself and getting out there. And, um, and then yeah, I'll come home. I'll be tired. Like if I'll go to a two, three hour networking event in person, it will probably take me like two, three days. recover my energy levels where I can feel where I can be around people again. But it's just it's just what it is. I know myself, I know how I feel and I just kind of work with that and work around it and do what I need to do.

Anya Smith:
I love it. And for all audience, like I hope you see like just the power of being authentic. And I hope it inspires you to just see like who you are, what values you have, the fears that you have, right? But like shape it and have time for reflection, have time to understand like what really makes you alive. Like what terms do you want to have for your own success journey? And use Jane's inspiration to say like, you know, she's being very true to herself. She's making it happen and it's not gonna be easy, but amazing stuff can happen. One of the things you mentioned like Fridays, you like to go to the spa and I was like, oh, that's gold right there. That's entrepreneurial gold right there for me.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah, so my weekends I usually I do all the stuff that I like doing I go for a massage I go I like ice baths so I'll go and do like an ice bath workshop in Bangkok or meet up with a friend to go out for a nice long brunch or if sometimes I feel really tired I will I will sleep on my sofa in front of Netflix and get pizza. It just depends but. Yeah, I usually I work hard during the week and then at the weekends I chill a bit more. I still work. I mostly work seven days a week, but it's just what you have to do when you start out and when you have your own business for a while. But yeah, I take it more easy and get a foot massage or a facial.

Anya Smith:
Yeah,

Jane Kisnica:
or

Anya Smith:
I love that.

Jane Kisnica:
go for a nice dinner, have some nice sushi, or whatever it might be that my

Anya Smith:
Ugh.

Jane Kisnica:
heart at the moment, at that moment feels that it needs to kind of fill itself.

Anya Smith:
that. And Jane, how should our audience connect with you? Where should they find you if they want to work with you?

Jane Kisnica:
Um, LinkedIn is the best place. Um, so you're going to have my name in the, in the shout notes,

Anya Smith:
Oh,

Jane Kisnica:
right?

Anya Smith:
I will. I will. I will totally put the name and the link. I just want to hear from you.

Jane Kisnica:
Yeah. So yeah, you can find me Jane Kisnica. Um, it's, it's a hard surname to find, but, um, spell out or whatever pronounced, but yeah, Jane Kisnica on, on LinkedIn. That's where I'm the most active. I don't really use any other social media as much, so that's probably the best. And it has links to my websites and my calendly, so you can book in calls and things like that.

Anya Smith:
Yes, please follow Jane has like amazing posts, amazing content, very authentic. Like I love it. Um, just fun. You get to see her, her humor and her personality in every post. So, uh, love it. And to wrap up Jane, we have three short bit questions and then I'll let you go and recover from this podcast.

Jane Kisnica:
No, it's fine, it's fine. Yeah, let's do this.

Anya Smith:
Okay, first one is success to me is.

Jane Kisnica:
freedom.

Anya Smith:
Okay, my current purpose is, it can be a little bit longer, but.

Jane Kisnica:
Um, my current, ah, I hate when people ask me this. I don't, I don't know. I don't, um, I think

Anya Smith:
That's

Jane Kisnica:
my

Anya Smith:
okay.

Jane Kisnica:
current purpose is, uh, help, helping. I don't know, I don't know. How do people

Anya Smith:
Is there?

Jane Kisnica:
know what their purpose is?

Anya Smith:
So for sure, I think you're just being

Jane Kisnica:
Um,

Anya Smith:
true to you.

Jane Kisnica:
right. Okay. Let me, we'll, we'll edit this out, right?

Anya Smith:
Yes, yes. Okay, different question. We're gonna do different questions. If I could have a superpower, it would be.

Jane Kisnica:
Oh, super power. I think stopping time, stopping time would be really cool.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, what would you do with it?

Jane Kisnica:
more work. No, I was just like, you know what, I would love to just stop time and have a really, really long nap. Or

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
I don't have to worry about, oh, I'm napping too long because I need to get out for work or need to go to bed or do work or whatever. Or yeah, just stopping time and not having to think about the times they're slipping by would be cool. So you can do loads of things

Anya Smith:
Yeah,

Jane Kisnica:
when you

Anya Smith:
no,

Jane Kisnica:
stop time. Like the productivity

Anya Smith:
I was like.

Jane Kisnica:
would be insane. I could finish like, I could like stop time and I don't know, finish all the work and then restart the time and 24 hours have passed. How great would that be?

Anya Smith:
Type eight answer, I love it. Like, I'm such an entrepreneur, I just want to stop time to do more. Okay, love that. And then last question in a positive context, going off track is.

Jane Kisnica:
Um, going off track. So what it means to me.

Anya Smith:
Yeah, in a positive light, if possible.

Jane Kisnica:
Going off track to me is doing things differently than what society expects you to do. So breaking out, building your own business, or I don't know, not having children, for example,

Anya Smith:
Yeah.

Jane Kisnica:
not getting married, not following all these standards that society pushes onto women, onto men, onto couples, just onto everyone else, just doing something else than you're expected. to do as a man, as a woman, as an entrepreneur, whatever it might be.

Anya Smith:
Awesome, I love it. Very genuine, very true. And I just appreciate you being authentic, you showing up today and doing this collaboration. To our audience, I also appreciate your time today. Thank you for joining us, another adventure. And I hope it inspires you to be true on your journey, being authentic with whatever you are trying to do, and just to see what's possible when you do embrace that path. So thank you so much for coming right up track with us. We look forward to having you join us next time. Thank you so much, Jane.

Jane Kisnica:
Thanks for having me. Bye.

Anya Smith:
Our pleasure, bye.